I’m prepared for whats coming to me…
But first, if I may, let me explain my side. Let me first say, I’m not a “MS fanboy.” Far from it. My love affair with gaming was at it’s peak with the PS2. I lord that machine deeply. I also oft lament the fact that I wasn’t able to afford the PS3 and subsequently missed out on some of, if not THE best games of this generation (I’m looking at you Uncharted.)
The largest point of contention between the two systems seems to be “ownership” of your games. Lets pretend for a moment that all media isn’t going to end up digital only (admit to yourself, it will) and that you want “ownership” of your game because you are a collector. If this is the scenario, I fully understand why you want the Ps4 over the Xbox One. If your problem with “ownership” is that you can’t lend the game to your friend (which, in reality, I feel this doesn’t happen often enough to drive the industry towards retaining physical disks), I can also see how this would bum you out. If your issue with “ownership” of games relates to being able to trade in your old or unwanted games, I also understand wanting to save a few bucks on the next title you purchase (which we all know, is the maximum you will actually save), I guess I still understand that. What I don’t understand it why that is the deciding factor for your system choice.
The second biggest issue seems to be the price point. With the Playstation 4 coming in at a hundred dollars less than the Xbox One, I can see how that is a huge factor for a lot of people. The reason, Xbox One costs a hundred dollars more, is because of the Kinect. I like the Kinect, I think what it can do is really cool and I think it can and will be an interesting supplement to games. So I’m willing to pay the “extra” hundred to get that technology.
The third and what SHOULD be the most important deciding factor is the exclusive games. Again, they both have amazing looking titles and I hope to eventual have both systems. I, however, am more excited by Xbox One’s offerings. I am a huge Respawn fan and Titanfall gets me hot and bothered (to be true, its a system seller for me.) Also, Sunset Overdrive and Dead Rising 3 blew my mind. SO MANY ZOMBIES! These titles combined with Microsofts proven track record with their online service, it’s the system for me.
What I DO NOT like about the Xbox One is the 24 hour online check-in. Now, this will likely never be an issue for me as I do not play the system without being online anyway but the idea that I can’t play the games with out the internet is one I am not comfortable with. I understand that this is the way that MS can ensure hacking is as minimized but just making you check-in to authenticate the game for it’s initial download seems like the better choice. Though, as I said, this isn’t a deal breaker.
So judge me if you will. But remember, there is no console war, the real enemy is beyond the wall.
Javis
I can understand the allure of titanfall(I’ll be getting it on PC). I definitely fall into the “game-collector” category. I rarely trade in my games, but often loan them out and borrow them from friends. Having been a PC gamer as well as a console gamer, I can justsay that DRM, especially internet connection required DRM tends to do more harm to the consumer than the amount of piracy it prevents. As for the kinect, it has some neat features, but I really don’t like talking to my games, and aside from that the only value of the kinect in this past console cycle was dance central. /rant
Ha, if that was a rant, you win the internet for nicest rant in history [bows deeply]. I am saving to get a gaming rig and can’t wait to join in another LAN bash but PC vs console is an entire separate flame war which need not be fired up at this point. I agree that are probably a lot better ways that MS could prevent piracy without pissing everyone off, that said, it really doesn’t bother me that much as it will never really effect me. I always go online to play anyway, so no biggie. I honestly think thats true for most people, but it’s the strange sense of entitlement that makes people think that MS, Sony or any other big corporation doesn’t have the right to try to make money and/or police their product. Would you agree that digital download is the likely future of games (and all media for that matter)?
I’ve seen the writing on the wall re: digital games for a few years now. I don’t see it happening this console generation, and maybe even not next (depending on how long this generation is). It won’t fully proliferate and be a feasible model for consoles until high speeds get faster and proliferate more across the country. I know quite a few people who are still unable to get high speed(unless you count satellite or cellular broadband) I’m always connected to the internet, but when I take my console elsewhere(which happens often enough) I would like the freedom to not hop online. I’m very much a prefer to play with others in person sort of gamer, i miss crazy 16 player Halo LAN parties on the original xbox, i miss shouting to the other end of a house/apartment/room at the person who just killed me or i just killed, and i feel silly doing that same thing into a microphone (i don’t even like talking on the phone, and voice chat in a game just reminds me too much of that.) I really think if preventing piracy were their concern, things would stay how they are, but with MS’s model it seems more like ensuring that they and publishers get to double dip on a game is their concern.
I agree there, the 24 hour check in is a bit much but we must ask, why do we think they did it? It isn’t to screw us over as so many thing (not you, I don’t think you said that) but it was a discussion, there was a profit/loss reason behind it. Not arbitrary assholeness.
I think you hit the nail right on the head there; it is for profit that they are doing it. As it stands, there is no way to assure that they or publishers get a cut of used games(i don’t think they should get a cut of them) but this connection ensures that, when a game is traded in, or changes hands, that it is removed from the original user’s system. By requiring any reseller(gamestop, etc.) to acquire a specific device from them that nukes the game from a persons console who trades something in, they can ensure that they get a slice of the pie as well. I believe this to be the sole motivation behind it. It isn’t because “ZOMG M$ IS TEH EVIL MEGACORP!!!11!1!!!” but just a desire to increase their profit margins and seek that holy grail that publishers have lusted after since used games were a thing: extra money from the same game being resold.
Well…I mean they aren’t really trying to double dip. They are trying to keep Gamestop and the like from getting even MORE profit than they are by selling a used game they got for a fraction of the price at nearly retail price (of course I’m talking specifically about newer released titles. And they will put games on sale eventually like they do for On demand right now. We have (Myself included I have to remind myself often) this strange sense of entitlement as gamers. Not only should they keep cranking out better and systems but they should also do it with our best interests in mind? I dunno just seems whacky. What other business operates this way?
But double dipping IS exactly what they’re doing, whether they admit it or not. They get the money(royalties etc) from selling the game the first time, and with this licensing agreement they get extra money the next time it’s sold. You’re right, gamestop does make rapacious profits from used games(i’m still bitter from my time of employment there), but they make next to nothing on selling new games(the profit there comes from monies from preorders being invested in high yield savings.) I know with movies, music, and books, our culture has largely shifted to digital mediums, but would you have been happy in the 90s if it had been announced that CD manufacturers had figured out a way that you couldn’t loan a CD to a friend and if you sold a disc at CD Connection you would be getting less for it because the RIAA companies had to get a cut?
I must disagree:) If we are still thinking about games the same way we are thinking about cars or TV’s that logic plays but they aren’t. If a consumer would spend the money on a new title but chooses to buy the title used from a game shop (that we both agree got the used title at a steal) then MS or Sony lost that money. That was money that would’ve been in their pockets otherwise. They also basically said that the game disc is arbitrary, you could lend it to a hundred people but must pay for the right to play the game on it. I mean it makes sense to me. They should make money on it. The disc IS a physical item, but the game isn’t. If games were’t on discs any more they could cut down on costs and (in theory) charge less for games. It’s hard because games are a new breed of entertainment, so comparing them to movies, books and television is difficult. But, if you buy a game for $60 and lets say its a shorter game at 5 or 6 hours that you play through once (Not including multiplayer hours) that is still $10 an hour for entertainment. And we can agree that most games have many many more hours of entertainment than that. Even when you include Xbox LIve, the console itself and the internet, it’s still a pretty darn good deal.
All i see this doing for Gamstop is them giving less money when you trade in a game because they will get less money for selling it.
The exclusive titles will be what sways me to the PS4. MLB The Show is my favorite all-time game and I bought the PS3 for that game alone. The Uncharted series was a sweet surprise though. I always look forward to the console wars when they occur. It is amusing to watch the frenetic chase for gamer dollars.
Yeah, the 2K baseball games are absolute garbage.
I’m not a IRL baseball fan so I’ve never played the vidja game versions really.
Hey Ben! As you’re not really an “online” type player, I can totally see Ps4 being the right choice for you.
I moved house a couple of months ago, and it took my ISP 5 weeks to connect my service up to the new premises. That’s not my fault, it’s not my ISP’s fault, there was some sort of technical issue with the exchange, shit happens, I get it.
If we had been in the middle of the upcoming generation, I would not have been able to game for 5 weeks, because the console that I paid money for would physically refuse to allow me to play the games I paid money for, because… Microsoft say so? That seems like a really poor business model to me.
Well, I couldn’t survive without the internet, me or my wife. Both our businesses rely on the internet. So, if my internet goes down for that long, I’ve got bigger problems than playing games anyway. Also, you know ahead of time that you are required to have an internet connection for the system, and yeah they say so, it’s their product, hey make it:)
And so they burned him for playing on Consoles…
Seriously though, kinect would be a[(n) additional] reason not to buy the X-Box. Besides the whole “being a console” stuff (:
Have fun anyway, i am sure one can have lots of fun with either console (dispite the horrible controles)
Ha, I thought I mentioned to you SPECIFICALLY Adren that I’m currently saving to get a gamin rig;)
I havent forgotten that, but still…
Titanfall doesn’t interest me but I’ve grown less and less fond of FPS titles over the years. Not because I think they’re an inferior genre but the market has become so over-saturated with them that I’m just sick of seeing them and playing them. It takes something truly special for a FPS to win my heart (Borderlands 2), and even then Gearbox goes and stomps all over it with their shitty business tactics. I can no longer support them.
You know that I’m a gamer that thrives on variety and I try to play as much of everything that I possibly can and, for me, I’m confident Sony is going to deliver that because they’ve ALWAYS delivered that.
As much as Ioved my 360 when it first came out, and I did buy it before my PS3 and Wii, it just lost so much variety over the years. It got to the point where the only reason I would boot it up would be to play the occasional session of Rock Band or play an exclusive downloadable title, but even those dried up as the years passed.
Microsoft instilled no confidence in me that it’s going to bring that variety back. Barring Titanfall, because I have little interest in it, they showed nothing that looked like a necessity, except for Killer Instinct. I think that could be awesome and I freely admit that, even if I’m concerned about the direction it’s gone in and the studio that’s developing it.
Also, as someone who deeply loves Japanese games, as well as Western ones, I simply know that the XBox One just won’t have NEAR the selection that the PS4 will have. The One will have Dead Rising 3, yes, but Keiji Inafune, the man who created the sereis, has left Capcom. Capcom has a bit of a poor streak when it comes to dealing with a series after its creator has left the company. The completely ruined Resident Evil after Mikami left and I’m not sure they won’t do the same with Dead Rising.
I’m that guy playing obscure shit that no one has ever heard of. I’m that guy ranting and raving about how Valkyria Chronicles was one of the best games last generation and everyone fucking ignored it like it had a goiter the size of Wisconsin. I’m the guy who tries to find as much unique and interesting things as possible and am more than willing to put up with really rough gameplay for more original and innovative experiences.
I’m not the guy that has to go out and buy Call of Duty every year. I’m not the guy who looks at every AAA title and goes, “Ooooo, ahhhh!” Just like I’m not the guy who goes, “Oh that new Michael Bay movies looks good,” or, “Hey, that new Nickelback CD is really top notch!” I’m fine with enjoying mainstream media, but only if I think it’s actually something special and worth my time.
So yeah, I will often pass up those AAA titles and people almost act offended when I tell them I haven’t bought Call of Duty or think Bioshock is a tad overrated. They go, “But you’re supposed to be a GAMER. You clearly aren’t if you don’t play online all of the time and think Bioshock is the Citizen Kane of gaming!”
No, I’m just a different gamer, just like Javis is a different gamer, just like we all are different gamers from each other. We all seek out different experiences and this upcoming generation, more than any generation before, has very distinct lines drawn and which console you initially invest in, will end up saying a lot about the kind of gamer you are and what aspects of gaming you find most important.
It’s not something to be ashamed of to want an XBox One, it’s just you are making a declaration about what kind of gamer you are. No generation of gaming since the SNES/Genesis battle has done that.
Well put. I don’t think this division is as stark as the internet or even you are hinting at it to be. Honestly, everyone is acting like MS is the evil empire and they are trying to extort every penny from us…I felt like they were more honest than Sony at this E3. I would like to go on record right now and say that the two systems this generation, are not going to be that different in their practices. Sony “One Two Punch” is in direct response to and an attack on MS. I really felt like that they were pandering to us. Now, I’m not saying that I think MS is some happy go lucky friendly time corporation, they are in it for money, plain and simple and they do not give two shits about any of us…nor does Sony. They want our money as they are a business trying to make money. It’s about the games and both systems have games I want.
The only point I see that Sony is winning is price.
Well, price, and the used games thing for sure. But, like me, if thats not really whats important to you then it comes down to games and online. For me Xbox One has both of those for me.
sadly…i must be burned for the same reason. but if its any console “wink” im probably gonna get both in time. anyway its better to get xbox, mainly because of battlefield 4 bundle or the game ryse. plus, PROJECT SPARK
Well I’m glad I won’t be burned alone, but I’m not interested in any of the games you mentioned (perhaps some int BF4, but little since the last outing).
I can’t get behind your logic, I fell that the new Xbox is Microsoft spitting in my face, I fell like they are counting on people like you, who do not care that they are being mistreated as a consumer, to continue buying their stuff because you have no self respect. How can you buy from a company that obviously holds zero respect for you? What is the next step after that? As soon as they sell enough of the new Xbox to keep their consumer base, what do you think comes next year? If you ate shit once, you will eat it again, and Xbox will serve a bigger fresher pile of shit until you stop buying it.
I mean, defend your position. Again, I would like to remind you that I would like to get them both eventually.
I am defending my position, are you looking for reasoning? You said it all in your post below the comic defending why you want an Xbox. You have to always be online, you never own your games, this is disrespectful to the consumer. Since when did the big name developers become more important to please than the consumers? It’s a terrible business strategy and hopefully they will be made to realize this, but the only way that can happen is through people refusing to buy it. If we keep buying their shit sandwich, they will continue to make shit sandwiches.
To use the “Shit Sandwich” analogy:
Some people just like eating shit sandwiches.
What may sound awful to us, may sound wonderful to someone else.
I’m not a fan of the One’s policies and I never will be, but those policies clearly don’t bother a small section of the gaming populace. Microsoft is banking on that fact and hoping that the small portion that doesn’t mind will be able to hold the line long enough for other gamers to buy in.
In my mind, Microsoft has jumped the gun on this stuff, as I think it will eventually be the norm in gaming. Sega did this with the Dreamcast, though the Dreamcast WAS consumer friendly, by adding online gaming before the world was ready for it.
The Dreamcast was a wonderful system with tons of great games and I love it dearly, but it was a complete failure. Microsoft may be in the same boat but only time will tell.
They may weather this beating for now to one day jump up and yell, “I TOLD YOU SO,” then get to look all smug and strut around.
I’ve said this time and time again but if the One was purely digital, which it may as well be, I’d be 100% fine with it doing what it’s doing. But selling someone a disc and then telling them they can’t sell, trade, and borrow those discs is just wrong.
But you’re right, if capitalism works the way it’s supposed to, then the consumers will speak with their cash and the One should, in theory, fail.
But gamers have proven time and time again that they’re willing to put up with corporations dicking them over. I’m just curious to see if the One is one dick too many.
My point is that we need capitalism to work in the consumers favor for once. If we cannot as gamers rise up to the challenge and boycott Xbox sales as much as possible this will only be the beginning of a long line of shit sandwiches. I’m aware this sounds like a slippery slope fallacy, however corporations have shown us time and time again that if we give them an inch, they make us pay for a mile.
I don’t know, I don’t really feel “disrespected.” I feel like what MS and Sony do business wise will never totally line up with what I want. I really don’t think MS is somehow MORE evil or disrespectful that Sony.
As you had asked of me earlier, I will ask of you, defend your position. I’d like to know how Sony isn’t giving consumers what they want, or how they are comparably evil to Microsoft. As far as I’ve seen Sony has come out and said they are giving us the no bullshit gaming console.
Well, I didn’t say either of those things. I just don’t think MS is more or less evil than Sony. They are both just out to make money. I didn’t say that Sony isn’t giving customers what they want. I just said that what Sony said at the presser didn’t make me want a PS4 more than the Xbox One. I must reiterate I want BOTH SYSTEMS! I just want the Xbox One more because it has the exclusives that I’m more interested in. And that may even change over the next few months as more info comes out.
The only reason I argue this point, or even care, is because if we cannot as gamers rise up to the challenge and boycott Xbox sales as much as possible, this will only be the beginning of a long line of new “I don’t give a fuck about the consumer” attitudes that will ruin the industry. I’m aware this sounds like a slippery slope fallacy, however corporations have shown us time and time again that if we give them an inch, they make us pay for a mile. This isn’t something we just shrug off, this is the future of gaming. If Microsoft makes good money with this business strategy everyone will get on board the vastly more lucrative “Fuck the consumer” train.
I think that is the fundamental difference in our stance. I don’t get that “Fuck the consumer” from them. This is their product, they make it. They spend a lot of money doing it and it employs a shit-ton of people. It’s business that now rivals (if not surpasses at this point) the movie industry. To be frank, I feel less “fuck the consumer” from the gaming industry at large than I do many other industries. I mean, I really feel like the banking, insurance and energy companies are the king of fucking over folks. I think you’re hitting on something though. Supply and demand right? If enough people buy the product, they obviously feel it’s worth the money. All you have to do is buy the PS4 and let the few of us that still want the Xbox One wallow in our choice;)
I fell that the only reason the gaming industry is not very “fuck the consumer” compared to other industries is only because they haven’t had enough time to make it that way. We will have to agree to disagree.
That’s a good point, actually. It’s still new and evolving at an alarming rate. But thanks for the all the comments Arasek, you helped make this one of my favorite posts!
Ok, well I wish I would’ve seen this earlier in the day: http://www.ign.com/articles/2013/06/06/microsoft-details-xbox-one-used-games-always-online
I feel the same way. People are going to get whatever console they want. I want to play Halo. So one of these days when I can afford it, I will buy a new Xbox One. End of story. Neither system is FAR better than the other. It all seems pretty much the same thing, so buy for the game you want to play.
I also enjoy the Kinect, and I think in the future, my kids will have a ton of fun with it!
Here here Brian!
@Elijah and J-Bone
To step in on your conversation:
Elijah is right about Gamestop getting screwed on the prices of new games and hardware. It’s the sole reason they push used so hard. It was the same story when I worked at Game Crazy. We made a few bucks off each new game and, literally, a few bucks off each new console sold. Publishers already make almost all of the profits from that $60 price tag.
I don’t think it used to be that way, but I wasn’t in game retail in the old days, so I don’t know. But all I can say is that game prices haven’t gone up with inflation. Since they haven’t increased, publishers take a bigger piece of the pie, and since publishers take almost all of that pie, game retail pushes used games harder and harder every day to make sure they get their fair share.
Frankly, if we’re to adjust for inflation, we should be paying close to $100 for our new AAA games but if publishers did this, gamers would throw a fit, so they nickel and dime us every chance they get, so we throw many smaller fits, Gamestop still gets to make a profit, and gamers still get to own their games and pay reasonable prices.
The system is bunk but it’s what we’re working with.
Honestly, I think games need to be CHEAPER, and then we can all buy new all of the time, because it would be affordable.
Isn’t stepping in on conversations what comment threads are all about? The system IS screwy, and i foresee a day in the not too distant future when companies like GameStop no longer exist. When I was at GS I saw a trend towards the company pushing us to sell more and more digital content, which, in my eyes, was all about getting the consumer familar with buying a digital download from a store rather than from their console’s dashboard. They are trying to do everything in their power to stay relevant in an increasingly used-media unfriendly world. I will likely pop the cork on a bottle of champagne when GS dies, but you’ll see a small tear because that means the publishers have won and choice in the marketplace has floundered.
Hahahah, dude I’m the same here, I don’t know its probably because I already have a long history with Xbox consoles….And their games….And my precious/achievements.
That is also a factor. I have spent the last, what 7 years with my achievements and friendliest. Hard to switch.
I just find it hilarious and somewhat infuriating when other people (idiots) try to change your point of views on your console of choice…Why? what does it affect you that I want X console over Y? You can all just fuck off and us be.
Ha well. I get it to an extent. Games, unlike other entertainment isn’t simply consumed. You have an active role in the outcome so that lends itself to a deeper connection with the characters (for me anyway), and by extension the company from which they were created:) So the intense feelings are warranted to some degree:)
You’re a better man than I Am. XD
Well to be fair, the back and forth here has been tame and respectful, so I don’t mind a little fervor!
Here’s my biggest problem with the Xbox One versus the PS4: Xbox one is less gamging hardware for more money (ddr3), comes with an option that I won’t use much (kinect), can’t trade games, less exclusive titles that I want to play (ugh sports), and the ones that they have announced are generally coming to the PC. I’m a PC gamer, and if I can play a game on the PC, I’ll do that. So, PS4 it is, only because they’re doing what people expect them to do, even though I’m sure they’ll shit on us in other ways.
It’s still early to choose which one, but I see one reason to buy Xbox One: Halo. And that’s a terrible reason to spend half a grand.
BTW, titanfall was announced for the PC.
And Respawn has said a PS4 version isn’t out of the picture. It would most likely come later or in sequel form.
Yes, I will have a PC someday, but it will not likely be this year. Again, the PC vs Console debate is a whole other thread:) See, this comes down to preference. The exclusives on Xbox One are far more appealing right now and as I said, though it does embarrass me a bit, I do like the Kinect and the possibilities it touts.
You just want to cosplay as Tom Cruise in Minority Report. That’s what Kinect is good for.
Of course, no one is around when you’re doing this…
Well, Javis IS short and devilishly handsome. You could do worse for Tom Cruise impersonators. How’re your running, couch jumping, kooky religion and closet homosexuality skills?
I excel at all.
Having read your comment section… Burn, Baby BURN!
ha ha [strikes match]
As someone who never has more than a passing interest in consoles anyway, I’m curious to see if the One gets a big hacker community the way software with unreasonable DRM tends to. Jailbreaking Apple hardware is still a thing, too. Maybe this is another instance of Microsoft copying Apple (though inadvertently).
This is true, they could just be painting a [bigger] target on their back.
Even if I wanted it (and that’s a big if), the Xbox One won’t be available on my country, neither the rest of Latin America besides Mexico and Brazil. The whole “check every-24 hours” quite possibly means that even if I import the console, it’ll become a nice brick after the first day.
I can’t blame people living in first world countries for not caring, but even if there is some way to bypass the region lock with proxies or VPN (which we won’t know until it actually comes out), there is no fucking way in hell I’m going to support a console with such draconian DRM, regardless of exclusives.
In your case, David, I think the the Ps4 is def the choice for you.